Steven Avery
Administrator
LaParola
Hoskier (no Andreas)
Schmid
NA-28
Hoskier (no Andreas)
Schmid
NA-28
Michael Swift on 8 'holies' in Revelation 4:8 - Trisagion
- Thread starter Steven Avery
- Start date
Steven Avery
Administrator
Oecumenius analysis
Villiers
And
https://www.academia.edu/11317241/N...3aOIPppba40N5b-wCdrCpIiO2ApQlHeRChEjWygQrP7Qo
Villiers
HISTORY, MYSTICISM AND ETHICS IN OECUMENIUS: A HERMENEUTICAL PERSPECTIVE ON THE EARLIEST EXTANT GREEK COMMENTARY ON REVELATION
This article discusses the earliest extant Greek commentary on Revelation, written by Oecumenius in the sixth century C.E. It investigates first of all the discovery of the commentary’s manuscript in the twentieth century and the subsequent
www.academia.edu
https://www.academia.edu/11317241/N...3aOIPppba40N5b-wCdrCpIiO2ApQlHeRChEjWygQrP7Qo
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Steven Avery
Administrator
Crazy Readings of Codex Sinaiticus
LJ Thriepland
https://www.followintruth.com/crazy-readings-of-codex-sinaiticus
REVELATION 4:8
This is a verse that includes a triadic declaration. Holy Holy Holy. 3 times the Greek word Ἅγιος (Hagios) is repeated.
The KJV has Holy, holy, holy.
Revelation 4:8 And the four beasts had each of them six wings about him; and they were full of eyes within: and they rest not day and night, saying, Holy, holy, holy, Lord God Almighty, which was, and is, and is to come. KJV
The triadic holy holy holy is found in all major Bibles, including but not limited to the NIV, ESV, NASB, NET Bible, ISV, ASV, ERV and youngs literal Bible.
The reading is found in the Westcott and Hort text
καὶ τὰ τέσσερα ζῷα, ἓν καθ’ ἓν αὐτῶν ἔχων ἀνὰ πτέρυγας ἕξ, κυκλόθεν καὶ ἔσωθεν γέμουσιν ὀφθαλμῶν· καὶ ἀνάπαυσιν οὐκ ἔχουσιν ἡμέρας καὶ νυκτὸς λέγοντες Ἅγιος ἅγιος ἅγιος Κύριος, ὁ θεός, ὁ παντοκράτωρ, ὁ ἦν καὶ ὁ ὢν καὶ ὁ ἐρχόμενος.
The Greek of the UBS 4 and the Nestle Aland 27 text both read the same with Ἅγιος repeated 3 times.
καὶ τὰ τέσσερα / τέσσαρα ζῷα, ἓν καθ’ ἓν αὐτῶν ἔχων ἀνὰ πτέρυγας ἕξ, κυκλόθεν καὶ ἔσωθεν γέμουσιν ὀφθαλμῶν· καὶ ἀνάπαυσιν οὐκ ἔχουσιν ἡμέρας καὶ νυκτὸς λέγοντες Ἅγιος ἅγιος ἅγιος Κύριος, ὁ θεός, ὁ παντοκράτωρ, ὁ ἦν καὶ ὁ ὢν καὶ ὁ ἐρχόμενος.
In codex Sinaiticus, however, Ἅγιος (Holy) is repeated 8 times.
The verse is written as follows
και αναπαυϲιν ουχ εξοϲαν ημεραϲ και νυκτοϲ λεγοντεϲ αγιοϲ · αγιοϲ · αγιοϲ · αγιοϲ · αγιοϲ · αγιοϲ ˙ αγιοϲ αγιοϲ κϲ ┬ θϲ παντοκρατωρ · ο ην και ο ων και ο ερχομενοϲ”
We can put aside the the fact that this is NOT a scribal copyist error. You don’t write a word 8 times instead of 3 as a mistake. EVEN allowing for a very unlikely repeat of the 3 words this would still only allow for a maximum of 6 times and if we allowed for the copyist to somehow have repeated it 3 times we would come to a total of 9 repetitions not 8. The obvious fact is this was a deliberate and conscious decision that the scribe made to include the word 8 times. This, then is not a scribal error but a deliberate scribal alteration.
It is interesting that the UBS and Nestle Aland text do not include the 8 repetitions, especially as so much authority is given to this manuscript along with Vaticanus. The fact that the entire book of Revelation is missing from Vaticanus so we have no reading at all in this verse from the manuscript to counter the reading of Sinaiticus. This then would make the none inclusion of the 8 fold repetition found in Sinaiticus a dishonest exclusion, especially when we take into consideration the longer ending of Mark and the authority given to these 2 manuscripts there.
Now, although I cannot in any way prove a direct connection, and there may well not actually be one, it must at least be noted that there is a possibility that this is an Octoecho or at least an allusion to one, which was not developed as a concept until much later with John of Damascus in the 7th or 8th century.
If this is, in fact, an Octoecho then this would categorically rule out Sinaiticus from being a 4th century manuscript.
LJ Thriepland
https://www.followintruth.com/crazy-readings-of-codex-sinaiticus
REVELATION 4:8
This is a verse that includes a triadic declaration. Holy Holy Holy. 3 times the Greek word Ἅγιος (Hagios) is repeated.
The KJV has Holy, holy, holy.
Revelation 4:8 And the four beasts had each of them six wings about him; and they were full of eyes within: and they rest not day and night, saying, Holy, holy, holy, Lord God Almighty, which was, and is, and is to come. KJV
The triadic holy holy holy is found in all major Bibles, including but not limited to the NIV, ESV, NASB, NET Bible, ISV, ASV, ERV and youngs literal Bible.
The reading is found in the Westcott and Hort text
καὶ τὰ τέσσερα ζῷα, ἓν καθ’ ἓν αὐτῶν ἔχων ἀνὰ πτέρυγας ἕξ, κυκλόθεν καὶ ἔσωθεν γέμουσιν ὀφθαλμῶν· καὶ ἀνάπαυσιν οὐκ ἔχουσιν ἡμέρας καὶ νυκτὸς λέγοντες Ἅγιος ἅγιος ἅγιος Κύριος, ὁ θεός, ὁ παντοκράτωρ, ὁ ἦν καὶ ὁ ὢν καὶ ὁ ἐρχόμενος.
The Greek of the UBS 4 and the Nestle Aland 27 text both read the same with Ἅγιος repeated 3 times.
καὶ τὰ τέσσερα / τέσσαρα ζῷα, ἓν καθ’ ἓν αὐτῶν ἔχων ἀνὰ πτέρυγας ἕξ, κυκλόθεν καὶ ἔσωθεν γέμουσιν ὀφθαλμῶν· καὶ ἀνάπαυσιν οὐκ ἔχουσιν ἡμέρας καὶ νυκτὸς λέγοντες Ἅγιος ἅγιος ἅγιος Κύριος, ὁ θεός, ὁ παντοκράτωρ, ὁ ἦν καὶ ὁ ὢν καὶ ὁ ἐρχόμενος.
In codex Sinaiticus, however, Ἅγιος (Holy) is repeated 8 times.
The verse is written as follows
και αναπαυϲιν ουχ εξοϲαν ημεραϲ και νυκτοϲ λεγοντεϲ αγιοϲ · αγιοϲ · αγιοϲ · αγιοϲ · αγιοϲ · αγιοϲ ˙ αγιοϲ αγιοϲ κϲ ┬ θϲ παντοκρατωρ · ο ην και ο ων και ο ερχομενοϲ”
We can put aside the the fact that this is NOT a scribal copyist error. You don’t write a word 8 times instead of 3 as a mistake. EVEN allowing for a very unlikely repeat of the 3 words this would still only allow for a maximum of 6 times and if we allowed for the copyist to somehow have repeated it 3 times we would come to a total of 9 repetitions not 8. The obvious fact is this was a deliberate and conscious decision that the scribe made to include the word 8 times. This, then is not a scribal error but a deliberate scribal alteration.
It is interesting that the UBS and Nestle Aland text do not include the 8 repetitions, especially as so much authority is given to this manuscript along with Vaticanus. The fact that the entire book of Revelation is missing from Vaticanus so we have no reading at all in this verse from the manuscript to counter the reading of Sinaiticus. This then would make the none inclusion of the 8 fold repetition found in Sinaiticus a dishonest exclusion, especially when we take into consideration the longer ending of Mark and the authority given to these 2 manuscripts there.
Now, although I cannot in any way prove a direct connection, and there may well not actually be one, it must at least be noted that there is a possibility that this is an Octoecho or at least an allusion to one, which was not developed as a concept until much later with John of Damascus in the 7th or 8th century.
If this is, in fact, an Octoecho then this would categorically rule out Sinaiticus from being a 4th century manuscript.