Steven Avery
Administrator
Kept Pure in All Ages Conference
Lecture: The Received Text (Origins, Transmission, and Preservation)
May 11, 2021
BVDB
Dr. Riddle, and his bizarre take on the Greek NT Manuscript pool.
https://www.tapatalk.com/groups/bib...s-bizarre-take-on-the-greek-nt-man-t6327.html
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MMR challenged JR on a questionable statement on extant Greek mss.
The spot is placed on the next post, it is really at about 55:30, so I will remove MMR's strange 56:00:00
The quote without the ...
First, it is clear that the claim from Jeffrey Riddle is wrong, Putting aside papyri, even most of them that are small have a lot more than a "few words or a few verses". Jeffrey Riddle should acknowledge that the quote needs tweaking.
Similarly, MMR put himself on the hook with:
So if there are 5,000 left after the papyri are removed, MMR claims that 4,900 "generally contain a couple hundred leaves". It is sloppy number handling to give a precise number, 98%, followed by a slippery qualifier, "generally."
Unless he is ready to try to support the claim, MMR should simply retract it with an apology.
Coming from that, do the 5,000 extant NT Greek manuscripts average (mean) 400 pages? 200 leaves?
Maybe that number exists somewhere, but I don't think MMR has shown 1 million, much less 2.
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MMR quickly poisoned the well with an absurd wager, about not speaking on TC for 20 years, 10, 5, 3, etc. (He tried the Abraham mode of bargaining.) Jeffrey called it infantile. Childish or puerile would have been a better characterization.
MMR should apologize for that whole distraction. A person renting in a trailer park talking to a gentleman with a nice house and a summer house does not seriously offer a wager to give up all his homes if he "wins". This was a sad ruse from MMR.
Jeffrey threw out a number of diversions, regarding reconstructing the NT text, stuff like that, which while important in their contexts, do not cover the actual claim. He gave a few quotes from scholars that also do not cover.
NT Uncials
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_New_Testament_uncials
NT Minuscules
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_New_Testament_minuscules_(1001–2000)
Lecture: The Received Text (Origins, Transmission, and Preservation)
May 11, 2021
BVDB
Dr. Riddle, and his bizarre take on the Greek NT Manuscript pool.
https://www.tapatalk.com/groups/bib...s-bizarre-take-on-the-greek-nt-man-t6327.html
====================================================
MMR challenged JR on a questionable statement on extant Greek mss.
The spot is placed on the next post, it is really at about 55:30, so I will remove MMR's strange 56:00:00
MMR
Concerning our 5000+ extant Greek NT manuscripts, Dr. Riddle states:
"very few of these are of whole books... most of them are mere fragments, containing at best a few words or a few verses."
This is 'spinning a narrative' at best! [Edit: I don't suppose the good Doctor has a credible reference for these statements, does he?]
The quote without the ...
"very few of these are of whole books, much less the whole Bible, most of them are mere fragments, containing at best a few words or a few verses."
First, it is clear that the claim from Jeffrey Riddle is wrong, Putting aside papyri, even most of them that are small have a lot more than a "few words or a few verses". Jeffrey Riddle should acknowledge that the quote needs tweaking.
Similarly, MMR put himself on the hook with:
MMR
@Word Magazine Dr. Riddle, the quotations that you provided do not line up with what you are asserting. That said, I agree with you that the papyri are very fragmented—but, they only comprise a couple percent of the well over 5000 Gk. NT MSS. The remaining 98% or so generally contain a couple hundred leaves (and of course, there's generally two pages per folio). This would mean that there's a couple million pages of Greek NT MSS extant—as opposed to the slim pickings you would have us believe.
So if there are 5,000 left after the papyri are removed, MMR claims that 4,900 "generally contain a couple hundred leaves". It is sloppy number handling to give a precise number, 98%, followed by a slippery qualifier, "generally."
Unless he is ready to try to support the claim, MMR should simply retract it with an apology.
Coming from that, do the 5,000 extant NT Greek manuscripts average (mean) 400 pages? 200 leaves?
Maybe that number exists somewhere, but I don't think MMR has shown 1 million, much less 2.
==================================================
MMR quickly poisoned the well with an absurd wager, about not speaking on TC for 20 years, 10, 5, 3, etc. (He tried the Abraham mode of bargaining.) Jeffrey called it infantile. Childish or puerile would have been a better characterization.
MMR should apologize for that whole distraction. A person renting in a trailer park talking to a gentleman with a nice house and a summer house does not seriously offer a wager to give up all his homes if he "wins". This was a sad ruse from MMR.
Jeffrey threw out a number of diversions, regarding reconstructing the NT text, stuff like that, which while important in their contexts, do not cover the actual claim. He gave a few quotes from scholars that also do not cover.
NT Uncials
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_New_Testament_uncials
NT Minuscules
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_New_Testament_minuscules_(1001–2000)
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