first part of Hermas

Steven Avery

Steven Avery

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Constantius

Biography
] Moreover, Sir T. Phillipps publicly announced in the Athenaeum (see No. 1536, April 4th, 1857,) that he had in his posession a Latin manuscript 1200 years old, and that it was in a state of complete preservation. M. TISSENDORF also lately DISCOVERED in a certain monastery in Egypt the Old Testament and part of the New, as well a the 1st Book of Hermas, all of which were written in the 2nd Century, or 1750 years ago.
Just a coincidence?


  • 1860, Tischendorf himself (German) Page 6 "...den ersten Theil vom Hirten des Hermas..."
  • 1861, Tischendorf quoted (German) Page 86 "...den ersten Theil vom Hirten des Hermas..."
  • 1861, Tischendorf quoted (German) Page 312 "...den ersten Theil vom Hirten des Hermas..."
  • 1862, Tischendorf quoted (German) Page 12 "...den ersten Theil vom Hirten des Hermas..."
  • 1862, Tischendorf himself (German) Page 12 "...den ersten Theil vom Hirten des Hermas..."

German translated:


  • 1860, Tischendorf himself (English) Page 6 "...THE FIRST PART OF THE SHEPHERD OF HERMAS..."
  • 1861, Tischendorf quoted (English) Page 86 "...THE FIRST PART OF THE SHEPHERD OF HERMAS..."
  • 1861, Tischendorf quoted (English) Page 312 "...THE FIRST PART OF THE SHEPHERD OF HERMAS..."
  • 1862, Tischendorf quoted (English) Page 12 "...THE FIRST PART OF THE SHEPHERD OF HERMAS..."
  • 1862, Tischendorf himself (English) Page 12 "...THE FIRST PART OF THE SHEPHERD OF HERMAS..."
  • 1862, September 3rd, Simonides "...THE FIRST PART OF THE PASTORAL WRITINGS OF HERMAS..."
  • 1863, November 5th, Kallinikos "...THE FIRST PART OF THE SHEPHERD OF HERMAS..."
 
Steven Avery

Steven Avery

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books.google.com

The Christian remembrancer; or, The Churchman's Biblical, ecclesiastical & literary miscellany

books.google.com
1710558057326.png
 
Steven Avery

Steven Avery

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CAR<
https://forums.carm.org/threads/cod...simonides-timeline.13239/page-25#post-1460811

Steven Avery said:
  • 1863, November 5th, Kallinikos "...THE FIRST PART OF THE SHEPHERD OF HERMAS..."
Click to expand...

When you try to unravel your error here, you will find that the phrase
"the first part of the Shepherd of Hermas"
is connected to Tischendorf, not Kallinikos.

As to the date, this is what I have.

November 5, 1863 comes up on p. 90 of Elliott.
Nov 5, (17th) 1862 comes up on p. 36 90 93 which is date of a Kallinikos letter.
 
Last edited:
Steven Avery

Steven Avery

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They have confused Wright's summary, just like Scrivener did.

Wright was wrong. I wrote about Wright being wrong

It's in Who Faked
 
Steven Avery

Steven Avery

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bsky.app

@2notablec.bsky.social

Also Simonides states consistently from the beginning to end of the Sinaiticus controversy in England during in the 1860's that he only copied the "first part of" (note: "first part") of the writings of Hermas (see his fake letter from Constantios dated Aug. 14th, 1841).
bsky.app bsky.app
 
Steven Avery

Steven Avery

Administrator
Page 273: “I therefore took possession of this book, and prepared it by taking out the leaf containing the discourse, and by removing several others injured by time and moths, after which I began my task. First, I copied out the Old and New Testaments, then the Epistle of Barnabas, the first part of the pastoral writings of Hermas in capital letters (called uncial characters) in the style known in caligraphy [sic] as αμφιδεξιος (amphidexios). The transcription of the remaining Apostolic writings, however, I declined, because the supply of parchment ran short,

Page 278: Simonides continued: “The patriarch was, however, absent from home, and I, consequently, left the packet for him with a letter. On his return, he wrote me the following answer:— “‘My dearly beloved Son in the Holy Spirit, Simonides; Grace be with you and peace from God. “‘I received with unfeigned satisfaction your truly valuable transcript of the Holy Scriptures—namely, the Old and New Testaments, together with the Epistle of St. Barnabas and the first part of the pastoral writings of Hermas, bound in one volume, which shall be placed in the library of Mount Sinai, according to your wish.

So that would make Simonides lying every time the first part of Hermas was mentioned. That includes the initial story of how he ran out of parchment as he was working on the codex he selected for the job.

So any theory to deal with the extra pittances of broken up papers has to account for that - even that he might have added something before it went to St. Catherine's the second time, since the ONLY people who would have seen it then are Simonides and whoever carried it to St. Catherines in 1843, as well as Callistratus and the inifidel Kyrillos.

That is still before 1844 or 45 - and it is after Constantius I saw it in 1841.

===========================

12 April 2024
​

Yes, there are 3 major possibilities

1) it was simply first part, this leaves the New Finds with a big ?

2) it was the whole book, this means that some of Simonides writings were simply following the Tischendorf description, including at least the letter from Constantius about Sinaiticus (which was not produced afaik)

3) A hybrid two-step, where the later par is added after 1841

12 April 2024

David
Which I would say after late 1842 and before May of 1843. That would fit the timeline perfectly, if he tried to do a little more. I would love to know if there are any chemical differences detectable in the vellum of the New Finds pieces, compared to what is bound in Hermas, or even if there is a point where the vellum changes in Hermas in the bound copy.


right






17 April 2024
​


hi David
 
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