notes with Chris Pinto - Nov 2013

Steven Avery

Administrator
Subject: Re: S blows whistle on T by 1858 - Codex Johanneus - ** palimpsest
passage ** (Tisch corr.) Golden ms - other "very old" palimpsests
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Dear Steven,

Very interesting correspondence. I am particularly interested in this section:

Leipzig, 22 July 1857
to set out in the coming winter to that place where the dearest thing to his heart lies.

Well that reads pretty clearly that he knew of the NT he wanted in 1857. (If the story told by
Kallinikos was true, then Tischendorf had seen the entire MS. back in 1844, when he borrowed
it from the keeper of the treasures. This had been communicated to K. by another monk
named "Gabriel." Hence, Tischendorf knew that there was a complete copy of a New Testament
there -- he just needed to find a way to get hold of it. According to K., he took the first 43 leaves
without permission -- now, he needs to find a way to get the rest of it).


This goal is so isolated that it will also be able to take it away in isolation. A way will be found. ‘The world belongs to the bold.’ He must not fail where there is a great, splendid purpose to achieve

The plans for theft. I'll just take it. The beduoin will work with me. (If the rubbish basket story were
true, he would still be wondering whether the New Testament portion even existed. Most MSS. from
the ancient world have great sections missing from them. This was one of the reasons certain
scholars were suspicious of Aleph, because it was "too complete.")

Alexandria, 17 January 1859
and there is nothing to arouse suspicion.

Tischendorf - so far, so good, they don't expect my theft.

The goal of his journey is known at least here in Alexandria, but there is no connexion here with the monastery. He has heard again of the stories told by Simonides. He is in a hurry to go to Cairo and then further on to his goal (He actually mentions
the "stories told by Simonides" in his correspondence? If so, these would have been stories he learned from
him while they were together in Leipzig in 1855-56, before they had the conflict over the Shepherd of Hermas.)


Even sanitized, the extracts of the letters are incriminating. With SImonides in the mix, I better get this done fast. Note that this places Simonides speaking about the ms no later than 1858. Now this is interesting, because it is before the publication of the 1859 documents. How does that fit with the timeline you had? (I see no evidence that Simonides spoke of the MS [i.e. Sinaiticus]. Is there
more detail about the "stories" he told to Tischendorf?)


21 January 1859
his great joy, he has learnt that his Cyril is still alive.He is very eager to see what will be possible

His accomplice is still alive.
Do we know much about Cyril? Was he the one who became monastery head later? (This is the first
I have heard of Cyril. But even before this, I have suspected that Tischendorf was working with someone inside
the monastery. We know from Kallinikos that certain monks were "hired" to discredit Simonides, and
it may be that money changed hands in this matter as well. The whole operation surrounding Tischendorf
and the Vatican, and then Sinaiticus/Vaticanus resulting in the Critical Text -- has so much the
character of an "agenda" surrounding it.)

You are familiar with the quote from Dean Burgon, after he examined what the Revision Committee
did, yes? How he said that the whole thing appeared to him to be, what in the language of lawyers
is called a "conspiracy?"





Christian J. Pinto
Producer/Director
Adullam Films
www.adullamfilms.org
888-780-5049
1 Kings 18:39

"Behold, I stand at the door, and knock:
if any man hear my voice, and open the
door, I will come in to him, and will sup
with him, and he with me ... He that hath
an ear, let him hear ..."
-- Revelation 3:20, 22

"Again, the high priest asked him, and
said unto him, Art thou the Christ, the Son
of the Blessed? And Jesus said, I am ..."
-- Mark 14:61-62

"... if you shall confess with your mouth
the Lord Jesus, and shall believe in your
heart that God has raised Him from the
dead, you shall be saved."
-- Romans 10:9

"For God so loved the world, that
He gave His only begotten Son, that
whosoever believes in Him, should
not perish but have everlasting life."
-- John 3:16





From: "Steven Avery" <stevenavery@verizon.net>
To: "chris.pinto-comcast.net" <chris.pinto@comcast.net>
Sent: Wednesday, December 18, 2013 1:17:12 PM
Subject: S blows whistle on T by 1858 - Codex Johanneus - ** palimpsest passage ** (Tisch corr.) Golden ms - other "very old" palimpsests

Hi,

Some thoughts on the Tischendorf correspondence.
Keep in mind that this is, I understand, later typed by his daughter and may be sanitized. It is unclear whether the originals are also available.

"The page numbers are those in the transcription of the letters typed by Tischendorf’s daughter, in the family’s possession, photocopies of which have been deposited in the library of St Catherine’s Monastery at Sinai."

More is to come out in 2015.

First an ironic and prescient warning (this I sent you earlier, most of what is below is new).

Tischendorf correspondence
https://www.academia.edu/1123038/Th...he_personal_letters_of_Konstantin_Tischendorf
https://www.academia.edu/1123038/The_Discovery_of_the_Codex_Sinaiticus_as_reported_in_the_personal_letters_of_Konstantin_Tischendorf
Cairo, 15 June 1844 (to his brother Julius) :p. 81
He took only two letters of recommendation with him to Sinai ; one of them, from the superior of the Sinai monastery in Cairo, was of no use because this perfidious Greek wrote to his monastery that they might put everything at his disposal, but they should be careful with him with regard to manuscripts.

Next:

p. 83-84 Results of his researches : He has come into possession of [=ich bin in den Besitzgelangt von] 43 parchment folia of the Greek Old Testament which are some of the very oldest preserved in Europe.

No mention about wondering if there might be a matching NT. No mention of the trash bin saviour. Looks like the nail in the coffin of that lie. btw, Schaff says in one spot that Tischendorf did replay the story for him a couple of times when they met.

Cairo, 19 March 1853
p. 206 Despite the failure of his main goal,

maybe the fuller letter states this goal.

he is bringing back more than ten very old palimpsests, of which two are particularly valuable, one of the Old, the other of the New Testament. The first, from the 5th –as well as the 2d century forms a pendant to the Codex Friderico-Augustanus, and he has thought to call it, in honour of Prince Johann, the Codex Johanneus

And what in the world is this? This is very strange. Is that "2nd century?" OT palimpsest. I wrote Michael Featherston asking him. And similarly, what is this 5th century NT palimpsest? Apparently, whatever it was, it never saw the light of day. We can inquire more. Maybe these were Simonides-related palimpsests?

Leipzig, 22 July 1857
to set out in the coming winter to that place where the dearest thing to his heart lies.

Well that reads pretty clearly that he knew of the NT he wanted in 1857.

This goal is so isolated that it will also be able to take it away in isolation. A way will be found. ‘The world belongs to the bold.’ He must not fail where there is a great, splendid purpose to achieve

The plans for theft. I'll just take it. The beduoin will work with me.

Alexandria, 17 January 1859
and there is nothing to arouse suspicion.

Tischendorf - so far, so good, they don't expect my theft.

The goal of his journey is known at least here in Alexandria, but there is no connexion here with the monastery. He has heard again of the stories told by Simonides. He is in a hurry to go to Cairo and then further on to his goal

Even sanitized, the extracts of the letters are incriminating. With SImonides in the mix, I better get this done fast. Note that this places Simonides speaking about the ms no later than 1858. Now this is interesting, because it is before the publication of the 1859 documents. How does that fit with the timeline you had? What first spurred Simonides? Frederico-Augustanus? rumours? discussions/negotiations with Tischendorf in Leipsig?

21 January 1859
his great joy, he has learnt that his Cyril is still alive.He is very eager to see what will be possible

His accomplice is still alive.
Do we know much about Cyril? Was he the one who became monastery head later? I'm not checking right now.

Cairo, 15 February 1859 (received 25 February, at 6 :00 PM)

This next is interesting, you can read the whole thing online.
Anyway.

He announced openly his intention to make acquisitions with the name and the gold of the emperor, though the direct, official way did not lead to the goal, so it was considered a private agreement.

A bribe. baksheesh.

The oikonomos and he saw the golden MS and others in the room of [=bei] the old skeuophylax ; and then the oikonomos had in his room [=in seiner Stube] and showed to Tischendorf the MS of which the Codex Friderico-Augustanus is undoubtedly a part and of which

He knew what he was looking for. No red cloth, etc. However there is a room and connection to the 43.

Also first this one:

The golden MS. at Mount Sinai (1864)
John Dury Geden
http://books.google.com/books?id=_I5UAAAAcAAJ&pg=PA636
"Tischendorf .. in 1862 .. had described the MS. ... Evangelary... it is protected by a series of guards... the tradition of the monastery represents the MS. to have been the gift of a Roman emperor Theodosius ... AD 716-717

Hmm... and what is the "tradition of the monastery" for Codex Sinaiticus? There is none afawk.
I'll look for more to go with this about the Golden ms.

Tischendorf had seen another fragment containing Isaiah and other parts of the Old Testament on his first trip to Sinai. But the MS was no longer the fragment of 70-80 folia, but 346. Tischendorf was beyond himself with joy as he rushed with it into his cell. There he saw that the whole New Testament was in it : the only such MS in the world ! Neither the Codex Vaticanus nor the London Alexandrinus has all the New Testament, and the Sinai Codex is certainly older than both of them. ... future communication.

How would he "know" this before any real examination?

This find is an event for all Christian scholarship. Of course, no one in the monastery knew what the MS contained. And now more surprises : At the end of the book there is the entire Epistle of Barnabas, one of the disciples of the Apostles, of which a considerable parthas until now been considered to be lost in the Greek original, and for which the extant parts are transmitted only in later, unreliable MSS.

Hmmm.. again it sounds like a prepared speech of coincidence and amazement.

He had tears in his eyes,and his heart had never been so moved. When he recovered he thought how there might also be the Shepherd of Hermas text here ; and then he took a folio and read :‘The Shepherd’ ! He lost all control. He thought that it could only have been the Lord’s calling that led him to this discovery.

Strange. Why would he think of the Shepherd? That was already published in Greek anyway in a full text from Athos. And was not particularly important in terms of the potential find.

Anyway, this is probably the first "red cloth" story. Without the red cloth.

After the first bad news from the prince, Tischendorf had thought it might be necessary to revise the MS again in Cairo, for his edition of it, if he should have to leave Cairo without it.

What will be revised?

the Sinaite shave found a document from 1670 which states that the patriarch of Jerusalem has the duty of consecration, but can in no way oppose the election of the bishop. AndLobanov seemed disposed to act to-day through Argyropoulo at the Porte.

They can find an obscure 1670 document, but they can't find a full library catalog?

"Mr Tischendorf has informed me that the Sinai monks have the intention of giving the old Bible MS to the emperor through his mediation. But because this cannot be carried out officially until the newly elected head of the Sinai brotherhood is officially recognised, Tischendorf has desired in the meantime to take the said MS to Petersburg as a loan for the purpose of checking the transcription during printing. Whilst the undersigned imperial ambassador supports this wish of Mr Tischendorf, he declares expressly that, when the said MS is taken as a loan to Petersburg, it nevertheless remains the property of the Sinaites, until the superior, in the name of the brotherhood, formally, in writing or through delegation, finalises the presentation to the emperor." ... Tischendorf will be able to take the original with him. In this way the actual presentation to the emperor is also completely decided ;

Tischendorf always considered the loan a ruse. Get it in the hands of the emperor and then it is done.

Petersburg 20 November 1859
the famous basket evoked shock and amazement.

The basket story apparently had already been circulated.
Wonder if there is a real Tischendorf bio anywhere?

the grand duke Constantine and his wife. Tischedorf will be seeing the grand duke again in the next days and is happy for this. All is well. But on point he and the grand duke are not in agreement. The duke said that : Since it is not certain that we have the Sinai Bible, we must begin at once with the photographing, for which we have here in the Admiralty the most excellent facilities. Tischendorf said at once that this did not fit with his plans [to return to Leipzig].

So Constantine had some integrity. Tischendorf just wanted to finish the theft.

Petersburg 22 November 1859
p.402 In the empress’s salon Tischendorf displays all his palimpsests and MSS on 5 or 6 tables, arranged in order, that is, the palimpsests on one table, the thousand-year-old Greek Bible MS on another, the Egyptian antiquities on another etc. The emperor and empress spent a hour viewing them. They seemed very pleased.

hmmm... can we find out what palimpsests this is? see the Johanneus reference above.

Then there will also be an article in the court journal about his presence and thereby an indirect statement against all slander – the main accusation being that he had taken aaway the Sinaiticus.

Petersburg 9 April 1860
the ambassador in Constantinople had written that the MS was by no means to be considered as already presented to the emperor – stupidly the Russian and French Journal in Petersburg had written in imprecise, that is,incorrect terms on the subject – ; rather, it had only been loanned to Tischendorf.

He has had a quarrel with Norov, who believes that he had no right to take the Sinai New Testament away from Petersburg

Petersburg 18 April 1860
his find in a basket of the library in 1844, etc. It seemed to him desirable that the archbishop should know all of this from him with precision. He has composed the account in such a way as to mention the Russian archimandrite Porfirij, but that he himself had priority in the discovery.

Petersburg 21 May 1861 p. 440
He sees the emperor and shows him proofs of the printed edition and his corrections; the emperor seems pleased with the prospect that the book will be ready for the Jubilee. It will be a 'true monument,' he says. The emperor asked when he thought it would be ready. Tischendorf hopes to be finished by the end of July 1862.

Remember, Simonides had blown the whistle on the operation about 4 years earlier. Not just in 1862.

There is confusion here with dates of 1861 and 1862. I changed one or two, perhaps in correction, but anyway this is in the order of the PDF.

Petersburg 1 June 1861
the latest Dutch attack on his dating of the Sinai Bible

Warsaw 8 October 1861 p. 449
The duke told him that the news from the Sinai monastery which he had had before leaving Petersburg at the beginning of June was very discouraging with regard to the original of the Sinaiticus. Tischendorf was unpleasantly surprised, but he still does not believe that it will be given back

Warsaw 11 October 1861
Tischendorf's supposition – as one of the fifty copies made by Euseebius for Constantine.

Petersburg 25 October 1862
Neither the emperor nor the minister think of giving up the MS ; they only want to gain time. 'Time the wonderworking God!'

Petersburg 1 November 1862
After examination,Tischendorf is happy that all the apparent 'heretical' pages of the MS (because of readings which disagree with the usual text) are outweighed completely by several passages of great importance ... Tischendorf had to explain in detail the passage at the end of the Gospel of Mark.

Petersburg 14 November 1862
Tischendorf also showed them the facsimiles, in particular that of a palimpsest passage, since the empress had asked if he now called it (the Sinaiticus MS!) a palimpsest ; this, he remarks, was not very amusing. On the subject of the end of Mark, Tischendorf himself began talking about the dogmatic side of the MS. Theempress seemed to have already been reassured in the matter.

What is underneath the palimpsest? - what date is the text?

If it is lost .. that would be deliberate. Now, granted, the language above is not ironclad, what is really needed is the original letter, or at least the typewritten version. It reads clearly though of a palimpsest passage from the facsimiles of Sinaiticus.

Keep in mind, with a palimpsest the print on top must be significantly older than what is underneath. (usually with a NT palimpsest, the NT manuscript is the writing underneath that was wiped clean, like with the Old Syriac Sinaitic ms). Palimpsest passages are a minefield to presumed early datings.

London 9 February 1865
The Codex Frederico-Augustanus has aroused great interest in the British Museum:eek:n the first day there was a great crowd of officials and scholars; there is much talk of him and the Codex. He has agreed to give a public lecture on the Codex Sinaiticus in the Royal Society [of Literature, see next letter below] , in the presence of Londonélite society

London 10 March 1865
The 'orator publicus' proclaimed that he had performed many promotions to the doctorate, but none so happily as this one. He spoke of Tischendorf's many works, in particular the Sinaiticus, which shone forth, despite all intrigues – Simonides was referred to under the term 'Grecia mendax.'

We wonder how many SImonides references are in the full correspondence?

Ferrara 12 February 1866
Next he is going to Florence, to see a member of the cathedral chapter, the former librarian, who is in close touch with the pope (and who believes that the letters which Tischendorf has received from the pope were all his doing ; Tischendorf doubts this, because the letters show a genuine interest and knowledge of the subject).

25 February 1866

Vaticanus discussion, and Angelo Mai edition

Moscow 1 March 1868
the emperor had been unfavourably influenced by such people as Adlerberg and Schuvalov ... the manner in which the emperor spoke to Ignatiev.Namely, he had spoken of a return to the monastery of the original MS.

Some still had integrity.

It is a splendid thing to be a famous man.

There are many self-aggrandizing comments from Tischendorf.

Anyway, going through that carefully was fun. First time, earlier I jumped and skimmed.

Yours in Jesus,
Steven Avery
 
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