Steven Avery
Administrator
Textus Receptus Academy
Will Kinney
https://www.facebook.com/groups/467217787457422/permalink/836854807160383/
https://brandplucked.webs.com/errorsingreek.htm
================
Will Brinson - Ferguson
https://www.academia.edu/3714259/g00g_Hebrew_Aramaic_not_Greek
=================
Prolegomena No.180 - given in Twells
John Mill
Bengel
A critical examination of the late new text and version of the New Testament; wherein the editor [D. Mace]'s corrupt text, false version, and fallacious notes are censur'd, Volume 3 (1732) - similar in Latin by Twells in Wolfii Curae
Leonard Twells
https://books.google.com/books?id=Fh4512wR7toC&pg=PA114
The Works of Nathaniel Lardner, Volume 2
By Nathaniel Lardner (1684-1768)
https://books.google.com/books?id=u8IrAAAAYAAJ&pg=PA717
Introduction to the New Testament, Volume 4 (c, 1780 in German edition)
On the Greek Style of the Apocalypse
Johann David Michaelis
https://books.google.com/books?id=VbEXAAAAYAAJ&pg=PA528
p. 528-536
https://books.google.com/books?id=EWEUAAAAQAAJ&pg=PA528
https://books.google.com/books?id=3lcHAAAAQAAJ&pg=PA528
But when the rules of the Greek grammar are accurately observed in St. John’s Gospel, and are frequently violated in the Apocalypse, we have a difference, which cannot be ascribed to the dissimilitude of the subject : for the same author, who wrote correctly as an historian, would not be guilty of solecisms even in writing prophecies. (Examples from Bengel - quotes from Dionysius of Alexandria, including from Eusebius, Leonard Twells in Wolfii Curae- Lardner offers counterpoint - Revelation 1:7 Zechariah and John 19:37)
The Solecisms of the Apocalypse - (1902)
Thomas Cowden Laughlin (1868-1945)
https://archive.org/details/solecismsofapoca00laugrich
23 pages
The Apocalypse of St John: The Greek Text with Introduction Notes and Indices (1906)
Henry Barclay Swete
http://www.archive.org/details/2apocalypseofstj00swetuoft
https://books.google.com/books?id=Bng9AAAAYAAJ
Dionysius
Studies in the Book of Revelation (1920)
Robert Henry Charles
https://books.google.com/books?id=JM4DIYYhUFkC&pg=PA115
Irregularities in the grammar of the Apocalypse (1943)
Alfred Martin
https://dts.on.worldcat.org/oclc/15035631
Thesis, Dissertation Publication year:1943
Held by DTS Libraries
The Book of Revelation - (1999)
Gregory K. Beale
https://books.google.com/books?id=HjKUiljUwcUC&pg=PA100
The Returning King: A Guide to the Book of Revelation (2000)
Vern S. Poythress
https://www.amazon.com/Returning-King-Guide-Book-Revelation/dp/0875524621
All Power to the Lamb (2010)
James R. Johnson
https://books.google.com/books?id=IaeyJNdTXaoC&pg=PR38
Beale Ponthross error (Poythress) Stuart
Morphological and Syntactical Irregularities in the Book of Revelation: A Greek Hypothesis (2015)
Laurențiu Florentin Moț
https://books.google.com/books?id=x369BwAAQBAJ&pg=PA4
==================
b-greek forum discussion
http://lists.ibiblio.org/pipermail/b-greek/2005-January/032899.html
http://lists.ibiblio.org/pipermail/b-greek/2005-January/032902.html
https://lists.ibiblio.org/pipermail/b-greek/2008-August/047355.html
https://lists.ibiblio.org/pipermail/b-greek/2008-August/047373.html
https://lists.ibiblio.org/pipermail/b-greek/2008-August/047380.html
http://lists.ibiblio.org/pipermail/b-greek/2008-August/047392.html
=================
Will Kinney
https://www.facebook.com/groups/467217787457422/permalink/836854807160383/
https://brandplucked.webs.com/errorsingreek.htm
Someone asked about grammatical errors in the Greek.
Are There Grammatical Errors in the Greek Text of Revelation?
A fellow King James Bible believer writes:
Hey, Will Kinney. I encountered someone online who claims that the grammar of Revelation is corrupt. He gave these 10 examples:
In addition to the evidence for Semitic grammar imbedded in the Greek New Testament, the fact that serious grammatical errors are found in the Greek New Testament books may be added. Speaking of the Greek of Revelation, Charles Cutler Torrey states that it
"...swarms with major offenses against Greek grammar."
He calls it
"linguistic anarchy", and says,
"The grammatical monstrosities of the book, in their number and variety and especially in their startling character, stand alone in the history of literature."
=================
SA:
The Apocalypse of John (1958)
Charles Cutler Torrey
http://books.google.com/books?id=lQ7ZAAAAMAAJ&pg=PA13
Documents of the Primitive Church (1941)
Charles Cutler Torrey
Charles Cutler Torrey (1863-1956)
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Charles_Cutler_Torrey
"Apocalypse of John (1958) argues that Revelation was a translation of an Aramaic original written in AD 68."
=================
Torrey gives ten examples listed below:
1. Rev. 1:4 "Grace to you, and peace, from he who is and who was and who is to come" (all nom. case)
2. Rev. 1:15 "His legs were like burnished brass (neut. gender dative case) as in a furnace purified" (Fem. gender sing. no., gen. case)
3. Rev. 11:3 "My witness (nom.) shall prophesy for many days clothed (accus.) in sackcloth."
4. Rev. 14:14 "I saw on the cloud one seated like unto a Son of Man (accus.) having (nom.) upon his head a golden crown."
5. Rev. 14:19 "He harvested the vintage of the earth, and cast it into the winepress (fem), the great [winepress] (mas.) of the wrath of God”
6. Rev. 17:4 "A golden cup filled with abominations (gen.) and with unclean things" (accus.)
7. Rev. 19:20 "The lake of blazing (fem.) fire (neut.)
8. Rev. 20:2 "And he seized the dragon (accus.), the old serpent (nom.) who is the Devil and Satan, and bound him."
9. Rev. 21:9 "Seven angels holding seven bowls (accus.) filled (gen.) with the seven last plagues."
10. Rev. 22:5 "They have no need of lamplight (gen.) nor of sunlight (accus.)."
(Documents of the Primitive Church; Charles Cutler Torey; Harper and Bothers, New York; 1941; p. 156-158)
Have you encountered this before brother? How would you answer this? This makes me confused.
God bless Robert
Hi Robert.
The answer to this is pretty simple and it may surprise you. It is the Nestle-Aland, UBS, Vatican supervised Greek text that is the basis of the ESV, NIV, NASB, modern Catholic versions and the Jehovah Witness New World Translation that is GRAMMATICALLY INCORRECT, whereas the Textus Receptus that underlies the King James Bible and other Reformation Bibles that is grammatically CORRECT.
Undeniable Proof the ESV, NIV, NASB, Holman Standard, NET, Jehovah Witness NWT etc. are the new "Vatican Versions" Part One - the Documentation
http://brandplucked.webs.com/realcatholicbibles.htm
Undeniable Proof the ESV, NIV, Holman Standard, NET, NASBs, Jehovah Witness NWT are the new "Vatican Versions" Part TWO, which shows the whole verses, phrases and word omissions common to them all.
http://brandplucked.webs.com/esvcatholicpart2.htm
Let’s look at these examples. WH stands for the Westcott-Hort, Nestle-Aland Critical text.
TR stands for the Textus Receptus readings of Scrivener that underly the King James Bible.
Also notice that Mr. Torrey does not quote from the King James Bible. The man is just another confused and misinformed Bible agnostic, and he really should have known better than to publish something this misguided.
1. Rev. 1:4 "Grace to you, and peace, from he who is and who was and who is to come" (all nom. case)
WH - χαρις υμιν και ειρηνη απο ο ων και ο ην και ο ερχομενος
TR - χαρις υμιν και ειρηνη απο του ο ων και ο ην και ο ερχομενος
KJB - Grace be unto you, and peace, from HIM WHICH IS, AND WHICH WAS, AND WHICH IS TO COME…
The TR has that little word του in it that makes it grammatically correct with the genitive following the word “from” - απο του, which means from the source of
2. Rev. 1:15 "His legs were like burnished brass (neut. gender dative case) as in a furnace purified" (Fem. gender sing. no., gen. case)
WH - και οι ποδες αυτου ομοιοι χαλκολιβανω ως εν καμινω πεπυρωμενης και η φωνη αυτου ως φωνη υδατων πολλων
TR - και οι ποδες αυτου ομοιοι χαλκολιβανω ως εν καμινω πεπυρωμενοι και η φωνη αυτου ως φωνη υδατων πολλων
KJB - And his feet like unto fine brass, as if they burned in a furnace; and his voice as the sound of many waters.
The TR is correct. It has the nominative (subject) which agrees with “his feet”. The Critical texts πεπυρωμενης doesn’t agree with anything.
3. Rev. 11:3 "My witness (nom.) shall prophesy for many days clothed (accus.) in sackcloth."
WH - και δωσω τοις δυσιν μαρτυσιν μου και προφητευσουσιν ημερας χιλιας διακοσιας εξηκοντα περιβεβλημενους σακκους
TR - και δωσω τοις δυσιν μαρτυσιν μου και προφητευσουσιν ημερας χιλιας διακοσιας εξηκοντα περιβεβλημενοι σακκους
KJB - my two witnesses, and they shall prophesy a thousand two hundred and threescore days, clothed in sackcloth.
Here it is Mr. Torrey who is wrong both in his quote of the verse and in the grammatical points he brings up. “witnesses” is NOT in the nominative case. It is the dative, as it should be. And the word “sackcloth” in the phrase “clothed in sackcloth” is correct.
If the verb “to clothe” (periballo) is used without the word “en”, then it is followed by the accusative. See Mark 16:5; Luke 23:11; John 19:2 and Revelation 7:9 and 13 “arrayed in white robes”; Rev. 12:1 “a woman clothes with the sun”; Rev. 17:4; 18:16 and 19:8 “she should be arrayed in fine linen.”
4. Rev. 14:14 "I saw on the cloud one seated like unto a Son of Man (accus.) having (nom.) upon his head a golden crown."
WH - και ειδον και ιδου νεφελη λευκη και επι την νεφελην καθημενον ομοιον υιον ανθρωπου εχων επι της κεφαλης αυτου στεφανον χρυσουν και εν τη χειρι αυτου δρεπανον οξυ
TR - και ειδον και ιδου νεφελη λευκη και επι την νεφελην καθημενος ομοιος υιω ανθρωπου εχων επι της κεφαλης αυτου στεφανον χρυσουν και εν τη χειρι αυτου δρεπανον οξυ
KJB - And I looked, and behold a white cloud, and upon the cloud one sat like unto the Son of man, having on his head a golden crown, and in his hand a sharp sickle.
There IS a textual difference here, but again the TR is correct, and Mr. Torrey is wrong. “Son of man” is NOT in the accusative case. “Son” is correctly in the dative because of the word “like” ομοιος and “man” is correctly in the genitive case. And the TR is correct with “one like TO the Son (dative)” and the verb “having” agrees with the subject which is “one sat (sitting)”
5. Rev. 14:19 "He harvested the vintage of the earth, and cast it into the winepress (fem), the great [winepress] (mas.) of the wrath of God.
WH - και εβαλεν ο αγγελος το δρεπανον αυτου εις την γην και ετρυγησεν την αμπελον της γης και εβαλεν εις την ληνον του θυμου του θεου τον μεγαν
TR - και εβαλεν ο αγγελος το δρεπανον αυτου εις την γην και ετρυγησεν την αμπελον της γης και εβαλεν εις την ληνον του θυμου του θεου την μεγαλην
KJB - And the angel thrust in his sickle into the earth, and gathered the vine of the earth, and cast it into the great winepress of the wrath of God.
Here again it is the KJB and the TR that is grammatically correct. All the nouns “the great winepress” are feminine and in agreement. It is the UBS, Westcott-Hort text that is in error.
6. Rev. 17:4 "A golden cup filled with abominations (gen.) and with unclean things" (accus.)
WH - εχουσα ποτηριον χρυσουν εν τη χειρι αυτης γεμον βδελυγματων και τα ακαθαρτα της πορνειας αυτης
TR - εχουσα χρυσουν ποτηριον εν τη χειρι αυτης γεμον βδελυγματων και ακαθαρτητος πορνειας αυτης
KJB - having a golden cup in her hand full of abominations and filthiness of her fornication:
Again, it is the TR and the KJB that are correct. It correctly has the genitive which agrees with “full of abominations”. It is the Nestle-Aland, Critical text that is in error.
7. Rev. 19:20 "The lake of blazing (fem.) fire (neut.)
WH - εβληθησαν οι δυο εις την λιμνην του πυρος της καιομενης εν θειω
TR - εβληθησαν οι δυο εις την λιμνην του πυρος την καιομενην εν τω θειω
KJB - These both were cast alive into a lake of fire burning with brimstone.
There IS a textual difference here, but it is Mr. Torrey that is mistaken again. The word for “fire” του πυρος IS neuter, but that makes no difference in the text. It’s ALWAYS neuter because it is a noun and not an adjective. It modifies “lake”. The word “fire” is not going to change its gender no matter what word it modifies.
See for example Revelation 2:18 “flame of fire”; Rev. 4:5 “lamps of fire” and Rev. 10:1 “pillars of fire”
8. Rev. 20:2 "And he seized the dragon (accus.), the old serpent (nom.) who is the Devil and Satan, and bound him."
WH - και εκρατησεν τον δρακοντα ο οφις ο αρχαιος ος εστιν διαβολος και ο σατανας και εδησεν αυτον χιλια ετη
TR - και εκρατησεν τον δρακοντα τον οφιν τον αρχαιον ος εστιν διαβολος και σατανας και εδησεν αυτον χιλια ετη
KJB - And he laid hold on the dragon, that old serpent, which is the Devil, and Satan, and bound him a thousand years,
Here again it is the TR of the KJB that is grammatically correct and the Westcott-Hort, Critical text that is wrong.
9. Rev. 21:9 "Seven angels holding seven bowls (accus.) filled (gen.) with the seven last plagues."
WH - και ηλθεν εις εκ των επτα αγγελων των εχοντων τας επτα φιαλας των γεμοντων των επτα πληγων των εσχατων και ελαλησεν μετ εμου λεγων δευρο δειξω σοι την νυμφην την γυναικα του αρνιου
TR - και ηλθεν προς με εις των επτα αγγελων των εχοντων τας επτα φιαλας τας γεμουσας των επτα πληγων των εσχατων και ελαλησεν μετ εμου λεγων δευρο δειξω σοι την νυμφην του αρνιου την γυναικα
KJB - And there came unto me one of the seven angels which had the seven vials full of the seven last plagues, and talked with me, saying, Come hither, I will shew thee the bride, the Lamb's wife.
Again, it is the TR that is correct which has the accusative for both words, and the Westcott-Hort text which is grammatically incorrect.
10. Rev. 22:5 "They have no need of lamplight (gen.) nor of sunlight (accus.)."
WH - και νυξ ουκ εσται ετι και ουκ εχουσιν χρειαν φωτος λυχνου και φως ηλιου οτι κυριος ο θεος φωτισει [επ] αυτους και βασιλευσουσιν εις τους αιωνας των αιωνων
TR - και νυξ ουκ εσται εκει και χρειαν ουκ εχουσιν λυχνου και φωτος ηλιου οτι κυριος ο θεος φωτιζει αυτους και βασιλευσουσιν εις τους αιωνας των αιωνων
KJB - And there shall be no night there; and they need no candle, neither light of the sun; for the Lord God giveth them light: and they shall reign for ever and ever.
And lastly, once again, it is the Textus Receptus of the King James Bible that is grammatically correct and the Vatican supervised Critical text that is grammatically incorrect.
I am not a Greekophile. I believe the English text of the King James Bible is the complete, inspired and 100% true and inerrant words of God. It just so happens that the underlying Greek and Hebrew texts that make up this magnificent translation are the right texts.
All of grace, believing the Book - the King James Holy Bible - 100% correct all the time - Get used to it.
================
Will Brinson - Ferguson
https://www.academia.edu/3714259/g00g_Hebrew_Aramaic_not_Greek
=================
Prolegomena No.180 - given in Twells
John Mill
Bengel
A critical examination of the late new text and version of the New Testament; wherein the editor [D. Mace]'s corrupt text, false version, and fallacious notes are censur'd, Volume 3 (1732) - similar in Latin by Twells in Wolfii Curae
Leonard Twells
https://books.google.com/books?id=Fh4512wR7toC&pg=PA114
The Works of Nathaniel Lardner, Volume 2
By Nathaniel Lardner (1684-1768)
https://books.google.com/books?id=u8IrAAAAYAAJ&pg=PA717
Introduction to the New Testament, Volume 4 (c, 1780 in German edition)
On the Greek Style of the Apocalypse
Johann David Michaelis
https://books.google.com/books?id=VbEXAAAAYAAJ&pg=PA528
p. 528-536
https://books.google.com/books?id=EWEUAAAAQAAJ&pg=PA528
https://books.google.com/books?id=3lcHAAAAQAAJ&pg=PA528
But when the rules of the Greek grammar are accurately observed in St. John’s Gospel, and are frequently violated in the Apocalypse, we have a difference, which cannot be ascribed to the dissimilitude of the subject : for the same author, who wrote correctly as an historian, would not be guilty of solecisms even in writing prophecies. (Examples from Bengel - quotes from Dionysius of Alexandria, including from Eusebius, Leonard Twells in Wolfii Curae- Lardner offers counterpoint - Revelation 1:7 Zechariah and John 19:37)
The Solecisms of the Apocalypse - (1902)
Thomas Cowden Laughlin (1868-1945)
https://archive.org/details/solecismsofapoca00laugrich
23 pages
The Greek of the Apocalypse is marked by a series of most striking peculiarities which, as has long been recognized, are due in large part to the influence of the Hebrew idiom. They appear in passages imitating the style of the Hebrew Prophets1 (with whose writings the Apocalyptist was so familiar2) or in sentences or phrases transferred directly from the Hebrew of the Old Testament or from its Greek translation—the LXX.3 The following pages present the evidence of this Hebrew influence in sufficient volume and with sufficient discussion of detail to make, it is hoped, a complete demonstration.4 The solecisms will be considered under three heads.
1. Ebrard ...
* Ewald, “Die Johanneischen Scliriften.” Bd. II., S. 52..
3 The LXX translation is more Hebraic than the N. T. and does not represent a type of Greek established and in actual currency at the time it was made, but “ its distinctive character is due rather to the translators’ exaggerated deference to the Hebrew sacred text and their mechanical reproduction of it.” (Thayer on "Language of the New Testament” in Hasting’s “ Dictionary of the Bible,” Vol. Ill, p. 40.) It is not surprising, then, that solecisms are found in the LXX nor in the writings of those who quoted or made use of that translation.
4 There are no less than 460 O. T. passages made use of in the Apocalypse. Westcott and Hort give a list of these in their “ N. T. Greek,” pp. 612 ff. and under the heading "Quotations from the O. T.” ; but the Apocalypse contains no quotations proper, although a great part of its language is taken from the O. T. (Toy, “ Quotations in the N. T.,” p. 253, Cp. Sweto, “An Introduction to the O. T. in Greek,” pp. 392 and 404.)
The Apocalypse of St John: The Greek Text with Introduction Notes and Indices (1906)
Henry Barclay Swete
http://www.archive.org/details/2apocalypseofstj00swetuoft
https://books.google.com/books?id=Bng9AAAAYAAJ
Dionysius
Studies in the Book of Revelation (1920)
Robert Henry Charles
https://books.google.com/books?id=JM4DIYYhUFkC&pg=PA115
Irregularities in the grammar of the Apocalypse (1943)
Alfred Martin
https://dts.on.worldcat.org/oclc/15035631
Thesis, Dissertation Publication year:1943
Held by DTS Libraries
The Book of Revelation - (1999)
Gregory K. Beale
https://books.google.com/books?id=HjKUiljUwcUC&pg=PA100
The Returning King: A Guide to the Book of Revelation (2000)
Vern S. Poythress
https://www.amazon.com/Returning-King-Guide-Book-Revelation/dp/0875524621
All Power to the Lamb (2010)
James R. Johnson
https://books.google.com/books?id=IaeyJNdTXaoC&pg=PR38
Beale Ponthross error (Poythress) Stuart
Morphological and Syntactical Irregularities in the Book of Revelation: A Greek Hypothesis (2015)
Laurențiu Florentin Moț
https://books.google.com/books?id=x369BwAAQBAJ&pg=PA4
==================
b-greek forum discussion
http://lists.ibiblio.org/pipermail/b-greek/2005-January/032899.html
http://lists.ibiblio.org/pipermail/b-greek/2005-January/032902.html
https://lists.ibiblio.org/pipermail/b-greek/2008-August/047355.html
https://lists.ibiblio.org/pipermail/b-greek/2008-August/047373.html
https://lists.ibiblio.org/pipermail/b-greek/2008-August/047380.html
http://lists.ibiblio.org/pipermail/b-greek/2008-August/047392.html
=================
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